[00:05] KLZ Announcer: It's the Kim Monson Show, analyzing the most important stories.
[00:12] Kim Monson: The socialization of transportation, education, energy, housing and water, what it means is that government controls it through rules and regulations.
[00:22] KLZ Announcer: The latest in politics and world affairs.
[00:26] Kim Monson: Under this guise of bipartisanship and nonpartisanship, it's actually tapping down the truth.
[00:33] KLZ Announcer: Today's current opinions and ideas.
[00:36] Kim Monson: On an equal field in the battle of ideas, mistruths and misconceptions is getting us into a world of hurt.
[00:44] KLZ Announcer: Is it freedom or is it force?
[00:46] KLZ Announcer: Let's have a conversation.
[00:48] KLZ Announcer: Good morning.
[00:55] Karen Levine: I'm Karen Levine, and I am stepping in for Kim as she is traveling.
[00:59] Karen Levine: I'm excited to be with you this morning on this bright Monday morning, March 10th.
[01:05] Karen Levine: Love to start our conversation this morning with our word of the day.
[01:10] Karen Levine: And Kim was, I guess, excited about the word I selected, which the word today is listen.
[01:17] Karen Levine: And of course, today we're going to have a lot to listen to.
[01:21] Karen Levine: And the reason I selected that word is: each year I read a little red book called One Word That Will Change Your Life.
[01:29] Karen Levine: And this year, my word of the day, or my word for the year, I should say, is listen.
[01:34] Karen Levine: And listen is a verb, and it means to pay attention to a sound, to hear something with thoughtful attention, give consideration, and to be alert to catch an expected sound.
[01:53] Karen Levine: And with that said, the quote of the day is, Be a good listener.
[02:05] Karen Levine: Frank Tiger was an editorialist and a cartoonist for the Trenton Times, and he started his career there in 1960.
[02:16] Karen Levine: You might be wondering, too, what was going on on March 10th.
[02:22] Karen Levine: And so this day in history has some interesting things I thought I would share with you.
[02:33] Karen Levine: issues the first paper money in the form of a$ 5,$ 10,$ 20,$ 50,$ 100,$ 500, and$ 1,000 notes.
[02:44] Karen Levine: We are moving into stanley cup season here in colorado with the colorado avalanche.
[02:52] Karen Levine: Potentially we'll see where they go in the playoffs.
[02:54] Karen Levine: But in 1900 the stanley cup took place in the montreal arena, westmont, quebec.
[03:02] Karen Levine: Montreal shamrocks outclassed the halifax Crescents and the score was 11 to 0, to sweep Challenge Series 2 to 0..
[03:13] Karen Levine: My favorite what was happening in this day in history is in 1922, KLZ AM, the radio station you are listening to this morning, in Denver, Colorado, begins radio transmissions.
[03:32] Karen Levine: Senate approved Amendment lowering voting age to 18.
[03:39] Karen Levine: And in 1980, Willard Scott becomes the weather forecaster for the Today Show.
[03:49] Karen Levine: Joe, did you have anything you might want to add to this day in history?
[03:58] Karen Levine: Not anything I have off the top of my head.
[04:01] Karen Levine: What else is interesting is today's headlines or some headlines that Kim shared with us.
[04:08] Karen Levine: And one that's really close to my heart is what is happening with construction defect.
[04:15] Karen Levine: We talk about that a lot when I am on on Thursday mornings or here in the studio.
[04:22] Karen Levine: And the construction defect legislation was passed over a decade ago.
[04:28] Karen Levine: And we believe that has been very harmful to our housing environment here along the Front Range and in the state of Colorado.
[04:36] Karen Levine: And it sounds like the Democrats at the state have two bills that are very, very different.
[04:44] Karen Levine: One would help to lower the ability to file lawsuits against developers and builders and offer more opportunity for housing.
[04:54] Karen Levine: But it's interesting because it limits that to lower end housing.
[04:59] Karen Levine: It says that since the construction defect legislation went into place, housing prices and rents have turned Colorado into one of the country's least affordable housing markets.
[05:11] Karen Levine: Builders and buyers have been waiting for the state to offer some relief.
[05:18] Karen Levine: The Colorado Real Estate Association is working diligently during this session as well to try to find some answers to the construction defect problem.
[05:29] Karen Levine: And what I find interesting is that they want to, one of the bills has some reasonable changes to construction defects, but it's so-called the middle market housing that they want to affect only.
[05:43] Karen Levine: And my question, Joe, is why are we only looking at middle class or middle market housing when this affects all housing in the front range?
[05:56] Karen Levine: The other thing that is out there is Arapahoe County is looking for citizen watchdogs that need to overlook the bill that was passed.
[06:08] Karen Levine: It was- or I don't know if it was a bill, but it had to do with- voters approved issue 1a, and that was removing those spending limits that Tabor has given us.
[06:24] Karen Levine: That is, you know, the taxpayer bill of rights, which helps people, helps us taxpayers to keep an eye on how our government is spending our tax dollars, and arapahoe county chose to remove that and allow the government to spend the over collects tax revenue, and it is supposed to go towards specific things and not to pet projects and political agendas, and obviously watchdogs in that arena would be important.
[06:54] Karen Levine: With that said, I've covered a lot of information.
[06:58] Karen Levine: You can always email Kim at Kim Monson, Kim at Kim Monson calm, and check out our website.
[07:09] Karen Levine: She has lots of great information there for you to be able to take in regarding regarding upcoming guests on her show, and that's Kim K.
[07:21] Karen Levine: I am Monson mo n son calm and I look forward to the conversations we're going have here today.
[07:29] Karen Levine: We're going to do some talking with my dear friend Leigh Brown, who's a realtor in North Carolina.
[07:34] Karen Levine: And as well, we have a gentleman who's written a book about affordable housing.
[07:41] Karen Levine: And I had told Kim it would be exciting to have a conversation about how do you bring affordable housing to the marketplace without incentives?
[07:55] Karen Levine: Um, with that, um, what else do we have here?
[08:09] Karen Levine: Oh, I did find this also very interesting, which was a headline.
[08:15] Karen Levine: Is federal office to move from denver amid sanctuary city accusations and in a bold move by the trump administration, the u?
[08:25] Karen Levine: S small business administration announced on thursday that it would be relocating the denver regional office to a less costly, more accessible location that would better serve the small business community and and comply with federal immigration law.
[08:46] Karen Levine: Administrator administrator kelly loffler said thursday that atlanta, boston, chicago, new york city and seattle offices will also be impacted.
[08:57] Karen Levine: Loeffler said that these municipalities do not comply with with US Immigration and Customs Enforcement.
[09:06] Karen Levine: The announcement comes on the heels of Denver Mayor Mike Johnston appearance before the House Committee on Oversight and Government Reform, where he was grilled over state and local policies and laws that limit how local law enforcement can work with federal immigration officers.
[09:24] Karen Levine: The SBA, which aids small business owners and entrepreneurs in their business ventures, also said it would be rolling out a new policy, requires loan applications to include a citizen verification provision to ensure only legal eligible applicants can access sba programs.
[09:44] Karen Levine: Our small business community is really an important part of our economy.
[09:49] Karen Levine: It's what's built america, and really small business has been under threat over these last years, with the rise in minimum wage, the requirements of family leave those type of things.
[10:02] Karen Levine: It puts a lot of pressure on small business and maybe this move will give them some more opportunity.
[10:08] Producer Joe: Do you have any thoughts there, joe, I'm hopeful that it does create some opportunity for them.
[10:19] Karen Levine: So you know we are very fortunate that kim has lots of great sponsors.
[10:24] Karen Levine: You may know I am a sponsor of the Kim Monson show.
[10:32] Karen Levine: I'm, I'm with RE-MAX Alliance in Arvada and have been in the real estate industry helping people buy and sell houses over the last 35 plus years.
[10:40] Karen Levine: And my office is located on Arvada, but I am very available to help people along the front range, both with a purchase of residential real estate or the sale of their home.
[10:50] Karen Levine: And would love to have the opportunity to help you out.
[10:53] Karen Levine: At this point, we'd like to hear from Roger Mangan, who is one of Kim's great sponsors, and he will be on later in the second hour to have a conversation, brief conversation with us.
[11:07] Karen Levine: But with that said, let's hear from Kim's sponsor at this time.
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[12:38] Kim Monson Show Ad: Focused and wise marketing is essential for your success, especially during tough economic times.
[12:43] Kim Monson Show Ad: If you love the Kim Monson Show, strive for excellence and understand the importance of engaging in the battle of ideas that is raging in America.
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[13:00] Kim Monson Show Ad: Kim focuses on creating relationships with individuals and businesses that are tops in their fields.
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[13:16] Kim Monson Show Ad: Again, reach out to Kim at KimMonson.
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[13:25] Karen Levine: I'm Karen Levine, and I am sitting in for Kim as she is traveling.
[13:32] Karen Levine: As you know, Kim Monson also hosts the American Veterans Stories, and that is airing on Sundays between 3 and 4.
[13:46] Karen Levine: I think we have on the line Minority Leader, House Leader Rose Puglisi, and she is here to give us an update of what is happening down at the Statehouse.
[13:57] Karen Levine: Representative Puglisi, can you jump in and fill us in?
[14:03] Rose Pugliese: Good morning, and thank you so much to you and to Kim for having me on today.
[14:14] Rose Pugliese: And, you know, what we've seen so far are the good Republican ideas basically getting killed in committee.
[14:26] Rose Pugliese: And I'll give you a brief overview and then I can go into more specific bills.
[14:32] Rose Pugliese: But the other thing that I think is really disappointing is the legislation that we're seeing is not the legislation that we heard when we knocked doors.
[14:41] Rose Pugliese: And I can't imagine that the doors that Democrats knocked were any different than the doors Republicans knocked.
[14:49] Rose Pugliese: And I have yet to see, we, our caucus, have yet to see really any bills that address the affordability crisis.
[14:56] Rose Pugliese: We are working on bringing forward legislation around decreasing regulations.
[15:04] Rose Pugliese: I think that's really important and you'll see some of that coming forward later this session.
[15:13] Rose Pugliese: We're not seeing bills that really are addressing the public safety crisis in colorado, and so I think it's really disappointing, um, that we are not really delivering as a legislature on bills that are really going to help Coloradans today.
[15:29] Rose Pugliese: So that's the basic overview of what we're seeing at the legislature.
[15:34] Rose Pugliese: I'm hoping the next 60 days will bring forward legislation that actually positively impacts health care and affordability in Colorado.
[15:49] Rose Pugliese: And then when we are getting more specific, obviously the attack on our Second Amendment rights has been the major theme that we have seen thus far at the legislature.
[16:01] Rose Pugliese: We saw the ban on ammo going through for people who are 18 to 2021, and that passed the House onto the Senate.
[16:15] Rose Pugliese: I will say of all the emails I get, the attack on our Second Amendment rights are the most of the emails.
[16:23] Rose Pugliese: That is the number one issue for our constituents and the attack on our constitutional rights.
[16:40] Rose Pugliese: We do believe we will see it this week in committee and then potentially on the floor.
[16:46] Rose Pugliese: So I encourage people to get engaged in committee hearings when they can, testify when you can.
[16:56] Rose Pugliese: You don't need to come to the Capitol and wait all day.
[16:58] Rose Pugliese: But I do think getting the voices of the people to the legislature is incredibly important on this issue.
[17:04] Rose Pugliese: and then we will continue to fight it on the floor.
[17:07] Karen Levine: Well, we appreciate Representative Poglisi how much work you are doing down there.
[17:14] Karen Levine: I find it interesting that you started the conversation by saying that what's happening down on the state floor is not what the constituents were saying at the doors.
[17:24] Karen Levine: And with the emails I'm getting from my at the U.
[17:29] Karen Levine: House and Senate, it does not reflect the way that I am feeling and thinking.
[17:35] Karen Levine: And I think it's important, and I know the listeners on the Kim Monson show are of like mind from the standpoint that there's an agenda out there that is being pushed, and it is not of the constituents and taxpayers.
[17:50] Karen Levine: And I think you're seeing that, and that's kind of what I heard in your overview.
[17:58] Rose Pugliese: And I know, you know, we always try to say the state's different from the federal government, and we're seeing that.
[18:05] Rose Pugliese: You know, I have a piece of legislation that I'm running with Senator Lundin.
[18:10] Rose Pugliese: It's bipartisan, but to really look at auditing the regulations that we have and starting to roll back some of these regulations that are hurting businesses.
[18:22] Rose Pugliese: I also, though, think that, you know, especially we've seen these attacks on the health care industry every year.
[18:30] Rose Pugliese: There are more and more bills piling, piling on.
[18:32] Rose Pugliese: And I think the common theme of the legislature that I have been frustrated with, you know, I was a county commissioner on the Western Slope before I ran for the legislature.
[18:43] Rose Pugliese: And I think implementation is incredibly important.
[18:46] Rose Pugliese: And what I find that the legislature personally, is that we continue to pile, you know, we say there's an issue, we agree on the issue, but then we continue to pile legislation on and on and on that never actually gets fully implemented.
[19:00] Rose Pugliese: So is what we've done to fix the issue actually working?
[19:05] Rose Pugliese: And I think, and when I say we, I want to remind your listeners that we are 43 Democrats to 22 Republicans in the House.
[19:14] Rose Pugliese: So most of the legislation that is being passed, well, I will say a lot of legislation is bipartisan.
[19:23] Rose Pugliese: And there are definitely areas of common agreement, especially around protecting charter schools that we've seen on both the Republican and Democrat side.
[19:32] Rose Pugliese: So I don't want to say that we don't ever agree.
[19:35] Rose Pugliese: There are definitely some areas where we do have some agreement.
[19:38] Rose Pugliese: But I will say, like, you know, these attacks on the Second Amendment, I heard not one person at the door say, hey, my life will be better if you continue to do this.
[19:49] Rose Pugliese: Now, Democrats might have a different feeling depending on who they talk to at the doors.
[19:52] Rose Pugliese: But there's already been legislation that has been implemented curbing our Second Amendment rights.
[20:00] Rose Pugliese: They think it's good, but they never let these pieces of legislation work.
[20:04] Rose Pugliese: And then they want to do more and more and more.
[20:06] Rose Pugliese: And I think really focusing on implementation and what is good for our state.
[20:11] Rose Pugliese: But, again, we're not addressing the affordability crisis.
[20:14] Rose Pugliese: I really don't think today that the people of Colorado have had a piece of legislation that's really going to make their lives easier, going to make it better for them to not have to work multiple jobs in Colorado, for single moms and dads to be able to provide for their families.
[20:30] Rose Pugliese: I just don't see that legislation coming through.
[20:34] Rose Pugliese: And it's disappointing because Republicans tried to get bipartisan legislation to happen on some of these affordability issues that we're hearing.
[20:43] Rose Pugliese: And, you know, I think of Russ Gonzalez and his cage-free egg repeal so that, you know, eggs don't cost$ 11 in Colorado.
[20:53] Rose Pugliese: And Democrats will say, well, that would have had no effect.
[20:57] Rose Pugliese: But it's an issue that I think needs to be talked about and addressed.
[21:01] Rose Pugliese: And I just I don't feel like we're doing enough.
[21:04] Karen Levine: Well, I know there has to be frustration down there from that regard.
[21:08] Karen Levine: What was interesting, one of the headlines I shared in the beginning of the show had to do with two bills regarding the construction defect legislation, which I'm sure you're aware of has dramatically affected affordability in our housing markets.
[21:24] Karen Levine: And I know when that legislation was passed over a decade ago, at the time, people were very well meaning, but they didn't understand the long-term effects.
[21:33] Karen Levine: And what's interesting is the headline had to do with two bills that conflict, but are both coming from the Democratic side of the aisle.
[21:42] Karen Levine: And they're very– one is more broad, the other one is more narrow, but it segments out the housing market for the middle housing market that will give protection there but not protection to the whole housing market.
[21:57] Karen Levine: And what we don't understand is that when you give benefit to one part of the market, it will harm the other part of the market.
[22:06] Karen Levine: So it is interesting to see that they're in conflict as well.
[22:10] Rose Pugliese: Yeah, and I think you bring up an excellent point.
[22:14] Rose Pugliese: It's one that I've been beating the drum on for the last two years.
[22:18] Rose Pugliese: We talk about addressing issues in the affordable and attainable housing crisis.
[22:23] Rose Pugliese: But then what we have seen are bills by the Democrats that have been signed in law by the governor that actually make the cost of housing less affordable.
[22:34] Rose Pugliese: And so you're saying, OK, on the one hand, you want to address this crisis, but what you're putting in place is not addressing the crisis.
[22:42] Rose Pugliese: And I think construction defects, you know, we've come a long way on construction defects.
[22:45] Rose Pugliese: When I started in the House two years ago, this is my third year, nobody wanted to really talk about construction defects.
[22:53] Rose Pugliese: I mean, Republicans did, Democrats didn't, the governor wasn't really on board.
[22:57] Rose Pugliese: They didn't really see how construction defects would actually help affordable and attainable housing.
[23:03] Rose Pugliese: I will say there's been a definite shift in actually wanting to have the conversation and bringing something forward.
[23:10] Rose Pugliese: And what I think you're seeing are developers saying, you know what, we are just not going to build affordable and attainable entry- levelhousing.
[23:18] Rose Pugliese: We're just not going to do it because of construction defects.
[23:21] Rose Pugliese: And so I think now there is definitely a realization that we have got to do something now.
[23:28] Rose Pugliese: I agree we have to do something, but making sure we're doing the right something is just as important as doing something.
[23:38] Rose Pugliese: So I do think there's definitely a lot of conflict.
[23:44] Rose Pugliese: There is one of the construction defect bills that I know I signed on to, because we have to have this conversation and we need to be able to figure out where there are opportunities to make changes.
[23:58] Rose Pugliese: Are they going to be all of the changes that we want?
[24:05] Rose Pugliese: But does it bring us a little bit further into having the conversation and actually addressing the underlying issues in the housing market?
[24:13] Rose Pugliese: So we'll see, you know, how it progresses through the House and the Senate.
[24:19] Rose Pugliese: We've had a couple of construction defect bills throughout the years, but they've never made it past the finish line.
[24:28] Karen Levine: Well, I know the Colorado Association of Realtors, of who I'm a member of, they are definitely putting a lot of energy and effort into supporting good bills with regards to construction defects and, you know, rolling that back.
[24:44] Karen Levine: so we can bring more housing and affordable and attainable housing to the state of Colorado.
[24:49] Karen Levine: You made another comment, which was about eggs.
[24:52] Karen Levine: And what I found interesting is, you know, we legislated this cage- freesituation, and eggs was one of the most affordable forms of protein in our marketplace.
[25:12] Karen Levine: We made eggs really not affordable, and so, um, I appreciate all the work you're doing down there to continue to whittle away and make things affordable for the citizens of colorado.
[25:25] Rose Pugliese: Well, thank you so much and thank you to your listeners for your prayers and your support.
[25:30] Rose Pugliese: We get a ton of emails and texts of support and I think it's really important to keep us motivated as we go through the last 60 days.
[25:39] Karen Levine: And I'm sure that in the next 60 days, your sleep will be limited, but just know we appreciate the work you're doing.
[25:48] Rose Pugliese: I really appreciate you giving me the opportunity to talk about the legislature today.
[25:52] Karen Levine: Well, I appreciate the update, Representative Pugliese, and we just ask that you have a great Monday and thank you for your time this morning.
[26:02] Karen Levine: Well, that was nice to hear that they are working hard, but, you know, as they have seen down at the state, a lot of roadblocks, a lot of legislation being presented, so a lot to work through to get to good solutions.
[26:21] Karen Levine: And I think Representative Puglisi is looking at: how do we roll back some legislation?
[26:26] Karen Levine: Because more and more layers creates more and more costs.
[26:35] Karen Levine: we are going to head to break here and hear from another great sponsor.
[26:38] Karen Levine: Well, I think she's pretty good because that would be me, Karen Levine and REMAX Alliance.
[26:43] Karen Levine Ad Voice: Award- winningrealtor Karen Levine with REMAX Alliance understands the importance of home ownership.
[26:50] Karen Levine Ad Voice: Karen Levine works diligently at the local, county, state, and national levels to protect your private property rights.
[26:58] Karen Levine Ad Voice: With over 30 years experience as a Colorado realtor, Karen Levine will help you navigate the complicated metro real estate market, whether you are buying your home, selling your home, considering a new build, or exploring investment properties.
[27:10] Karen Levine Ad Voice: Kim Monson highly recommends Karen Levine.
[27:14] Karen Levine Ad Voice: Call Karen Levine at 303- 877-7516.
[27:18] Karen Levine Ad Voice: That's 303- 877-7516for answers to all your real estate needs.
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[28:25] Crawford Broadcasting Disclaimer: If you would like to support the work of The Kim Monson Show and grow your business, contact Kim at her website, kimMonson.
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[28:42] Karen Levine: I'm Karen Levine, and I'm sitting in for Kim as she is traveling.
[28:47] Karen Levine: Remember to sign up for Kim's weekly newsletter.
[28:51] Karen Levine: You'll get the first look at all her upcoming guests, as well as her most recent essays or their most recent essays.
[29:06] Karen Levine: I have my friend and great realtor on the line, Leigh Brown from North Carolina.
[29:13] Karen Levine: And I'm excited to hear what is happening in your world, Lee.
[29:19] Leigh Brown: It's such an honor to be back with you and your listeners again and I'm glad spring is kind of here and ready for more of it.
[29:26] Karen Levine: Yes, well, we are supposed to have blue skies and sunshine for the next three or four days here in colorado and then we might see some moisture that looks kind of white show up on friday.
[29:40] Karen Levine: But with that said, we call it spring Right right.
[29:43] Karen Levine: But love the warm weather and that, you know, spring in the air.
[29:51] Karen Levine: I know the last time I heard you on the Kim Monson show, you had put together a, what do I want to refer to it as, a charity situation, a 501c3 to help with hurricane disaster victims.
[30:07] Karen Levine: and how are things in the real estate market?
[30:19] Leigh Brown: And we're talking about being a marathon instead of a sprint.
[30:24] Leigh Brown: And so the nonprofit that I started was, of course, initially going for emergency help, and then we were doing emergency housing.
[30:32] Leigh Brown: But now we're shifting into home repairs and helping the people who were devastated by the hurricane.
[30:38] Leigh Brown: who didn't have insurance or who got their claims denied because it was a flood.
[30:42] Leigh Brown: And people who didn't get anything from FEMA or if they got something from FEMA, it was inadequate.
[30:48] Leigh Brown: Because one thing that I brought to the attention of the new FEMA director, Cameron Hamilton, out of Virginia, he's wonderful.
[30:56] Leigh Brown: I'm just delighted that he's our new FEMA guy under the new administration.
[31:02] Leigh Brown: And one thing I told him is that FEMA has not indexed the help that they give.
[31:08] Leigh Brown: And you and I both know the real estate markets have gotten so expensive, particularly over the last five years since the COVID pandemic started.
[31:16] Leigh Brown: And rents are higher, home prices are higher, labor is higher, materials are higher.
[31:21] Leigh Brown: So when FEMA does finally give some help, it doesn't even begin to do the work that's necessary.
[31:27] Karen Levine: So we're trying to bridge that gap for people, because I know that the only way we can preserve our communities is to help people stay in them and not feel like they have to move and uproot their entire lives.
[31:58] Karen Levine: I remember we had a situation with flooding up in outside of Boulder County and just, you know, the devastation that water does and how much resources it takes to restore that housing.
[31:57] Karen Levine: But the work you're doing, Leah, is amazing because, like you said, keeping people in their communities and in their homes is better overall for everybody.
[32:07] Leigh Brown: Well, and I hate to be a conspiracy theorist.
[32:10] Leigh Brown: So I prefer to call myself a coincidence spotter.
[32:13] Leigh Brown: We do notice that almost every city that puts in place these plans for 2040 plans and 2030 plans for smart cities, 15- minutecities, whatever you want to reference it as, it's not long after they put those documents in place that they get hit by something.
[32:29] Leigh Brown: And we've seen it in the North Carolina mountains.
[32:32] Leigh Brown: Asheville wants to be a 15- minutecity.
[32:38] Leigh Brown: Well, right now we've got wildfires at Myrtle Beach.
[32:40] Leigh Brown: And South Carolina and Myrtle Beach had, of course, just passed a new UDO for a smart city.
[32:46] Leigh Brown: So we see all these things, and it just puts me on fire even more to say not all of us want to live in a city.
[32:53] Leigh Brown: Not all of us want to be on top of other people.
[32:56] Leigh Brown: A lot of people like privacy, and they like to have the liberty that our forefathers had.
[33:02] Leigh Brown: I mean, it's one of the reasons Colorado is so beautiful.
[33:05] Leigh Brown: You've got all these people that said, you know, I need a ranch, I need some elbow room, and they moved out there.
[33:10] Leigh Brown: not to be in Denver, but to be on their own.
[33:14] Karen Levine: Well, and it is interesting because these agendas assume or predict predict
[33:20] Karen Levine: Make us believe that we all want to live in cities and walk to the grocery store and walk, you know, to shopping and to dining, etc.
[33:29] Karen Levine: And yet we have been a nation of mobility and they continue to restrict our mobility.
[33:36] Karen Levine: We were having a local conversation at our government affairs committee this week at the local realtor level about parking spaces and we've seen how well limiting parking spaces has worked not only in our cities but throughout our communities.
[33:54] Karen Levine: And we don't want to give up our mobility as much as we want to be told that we want to.
[34:00] Leigh Brown: Right, I mean I don't, I don't want to give up the great american road trip.
[34:04] Leigh Brown: That's iconic america right, and I like being in my car when I can turn my radio on and sing out loud, or cuss or play or whatever, because I have the privacy to do it exactly, exactly.
[34:16] Karen Levine: Well, um, are you seeing the spring market pick up as far as real estate in north carolina?
[34:23] Karen Levine: Obviously you guys have a lot more obstacles as you rebuild after the devastation.
[34:28] Leigh Brown: Well, the market's doing very well, but of course, like every other community, there was a shortage of housing in western north carolina before the storm and then you lose a bunch of properties because of the storm, so it's an exacerbated shortage.
[34:45] Leigh Brown: My guess is, when I look at the history of areas that have been impacted by natural disaster, we're going to see the big upswing, probably in the next 12 months, as people do figure out insurance checks and they figure out if they're going to have to buy something new or where they're going to go.
[35:02] Leigh Brown: So there's, I'd say it's a lull in the market temporarily, although my realtor friends, everybody's got their phone ringing off the hook, asking questions, which is Always a good sign that people haven't given up on an area.
[35:14] Leigh Brown: But I think there's a problem that's coming, that people don't tend to look at: the consequences of how things play out.
[35:24] Leigh Brown: Part of the reason for the stabilization of our market over the last year has been the increase in interest rates, because it just took some of those bidding wars and calmed them down.
[35:35] Leigh Brown: But now that we've got some chatter in Washington, D.
[35:39] Leigh Brown: about getting interest rates down, I don't think people remember that if rates come down, it's going to heat those wars right back up.
[35:46] Leigh Brown: And we're going to be right back on that unaffordability swing we were on before.
[35:49] Leigh Brown: So we've got to take a big look at everything that happens and how we create opportunities without pricing people out forever.
[36:00] Karen Levine: Well, it's interesting that you would bring that up regarding as interest rates potentially move down.
[36:10] Karen Levine: After I think President Trump addressed the House and made comments about more favorable interest rates, this weekend was very busy for me in that I wrote several offers.
[36:24] Karen Levine: And in both cases, we were in multiple offer situations.
[36:29] Karen Levine: We saw the waiving of appraisal contingencies.
[36:41] Karen Levine: And so, like you said, it just doesn't help the affordability, attainability environment if we're going to put that kind of pressure back on housing prices.
[36:58] Leigh Brown: And I don't want to diminish people that need a better price and better interest rate to purchase.
[37:04] Leigh Brown: But I think there's a disconnect between.
[37:06] Leigh Brown: If you buy right now while rates are a little bit higher, you might be getting a better price than you will six months from now if rates come down and people start bidding again.
[37:18] Leigh Brown: But still, at the core of it, we're 10 years behind on building.
[37:22] Leigh Brown: And there's got to be, I think, a smarter group of local officials that don't say yes to everything and they don't say no to everything because we need to have housing options.
[37:33] Leigh Brown: But then, again, I look at the other side of the coin and the deportations have started, not going at a fast enough clip for my taste, but they're moving along.
[37:43] Leigh Brown: And I do wonder if that's going to impact our demand side some as we start to take some of the humans out of the marketplace who were using housing and were being paid to do so by the government and NGOs.
[37:57] Karen Levine: Well, and I know one of the things we've seen here in Colorado is so much legislation in last year's session that really put a lot of onus on landlords, gave a lot of rights to tenants.
[38:14] Karen Levine: and my small mom and pop investors basically threw up their hands and said, this is just more than we want to combat, that if somebody does not choose to pay rent to us and it takes us 90 to 120 days to get them out of our property, we'd rather sell.
[38:34] Karen Levine: So that brought a little bit of inventory to the marketplace, But that's a sad way to increase, you know, availability of housing when you have.
[38:44] Leigh Brown: It really is because those are the landlords that you're referencing there that usually do the affordable rentals.
[38:53] SPEAKER_10: Exactly.
[38:54] Leigh Brown: The ceiling glass and hardwoods and granite.
[38:56] Leigh Brown: They're doing something that's affordable to a working class.
[38:59] Leigh Brown: And when we lose them out of the marketplace, then not everybody can buy.
[39:05] Leigh Brown: They should have a lot of options, but, you know, every action has consequences, and we just have to pray for our leaders that they be more thoughtful and as voters that we elect more thoughtful people.
[39:18] Karen Levine: I had the minority house leader, Rose Puglisi, on earlier this morning.
[39:24] Karen Levine: And our conversation was that what she heard at the doors when she was knocking on doors to talk to constituents is not what's happening down at the state.
[39:37] Karen Levine: And so I think as citizens, I hate to say it, but we need to be louder.
[39:45] Karen Levine: These are jobs that our citizens don't want, because they're hard jobs and the ones that have chosen to go in there.
[39:53] Karen Levine: We really need to support that are speaking the way that we believe and feel.
[40:00] Leigh Brown: Well, I think the people are getting louder when you look at how infuriating it is with what Doge is uncovering for us.
[40:08] Leigh Brown: And I'm grateful for the waste and fraud that's being exposed, because it is giving the people a voice and showing our elected officials we're not going to put up with it.
[40:16] Leigh Brown: If y'alldon't get your house in order, we're going to do it for you.
[40:19] Leigh Brown: And I feel the same way when I look at housing, and I'm glad that Elon's looking at the Office of Housing and Urban Development.
[40:26] Leigh Brown: Let's make sure there's no fraud there.
[40:28] Leigh Brown: Let's make sure that the housing dollars that are allocated are being spent wisely, too.
[40:35] Karen Levine: I do find it interesting here in Colorado, the amount of conversation and press that talks about how bad revealing all this inappropriate spending, that this is horrible and, you know, Elon should be fired and he's doing bad work.
[40:58] Karen Levine: And I thought, well, if somebody was, which they are, they're stealing our tax dollars for programs that are not necessarily beneficial to us as a community and a society.
[41:10] Karen Levine: I mean, if somebody stole something from me, I would want them to be held accountable.
[41:16] Leigh Brown: Well, they're only angry because they're getting caught.
[41:19] Leigh Brown: Because there are Republicans and Democrats with their hands in those proverbial cookie jars.
[41:26] Leigh Brown: And I'm so grateful that Elon would take a break from his genius, billionaire life to do government work for a minute, because it's costing him money to do this.
[41:37] Karen Levine: And I think we continue to have those conversations that we are grateful that President Trump has, I think, a good circle of people around him who are giving him good direction.
[41:48] Karen Levine: and will continue, I think, to share his sentiment and the value of the Department of Doge government expenditures.
[41:59] Karen Levine: At this time, let's take a quick break, Lee, and then we'll get back to our conversation.
[42:06] Karen Levine: We are fortunate because of the good sponsors Kim has on her show.
[42:11] Karen Levine: And Lorne Levy with Polygon Financial is one of those sponsors.
[42:15] Lorne Levy / Franktown Firearms Ad: We'll be right back.
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[42:52] KLZ Sponsor Announcer: Find a full list of advertising partners on Kim's website, kimmonson.
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[42:57] KLZ Sponsor Announcer: That's Kim, M- O-N-S-O-Ndot com.
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[43:56] Lorne Levy / Franktown Firearms Ad: Welcome back to the Kim Monson Show.
[44:07] Karen Levine: I'm Karen Levine sitting in for Kim as she is traveling.
[44:14] Karen Levine: As you may know, through all of Kim's work with veterans, she is honored to highlight the USMC Memorial Foundation and all they are doing to raise the money to remodel the official USMC Memorial, which is located right here in Golden, Colorado at 6th and Colfax.
[44:28] Karen Levine: Paula Saros is the president of the foundation.
[44:32] Karen Levine: She is a Marine veteran and a Gold Star wife.
[44:35] Karen Levine: Paula and her team are working diligently to bring that remodel to reality.
[44:40] Karen Levine: You can help by donating at usmcmemorialfoundation.
[44:48] Karen Levine: We have on the line my dear friend and realtor, Leigh Brown from North Carolina.
[44:55] Karen Levine: And we've been chatting about her work, her nonprofit that stepped in to help families that were affected by the hurricanes there in north carolina and are now helping them bridge the gap between what fema has been able to help them with or not help them with, and home repairs, keeping people in their homes and their communities.
[45:17] Karen Levine: I thought we might transition a little bit lee and see um, if you are seeing any changes in the marketplace with regards to um, the nar settlement, which is the National Association of Realtors, and the fact that making our fees more transparent to our consumers.
[45:39] Karen Levine: And yet, in my practice, I believe mine were always transparent.
[45:48] Leigh Brown: And the interesting thing about it is that the changes that the class action lawsuit forced on realtors made it less transparent because, as you know, we now have to call every agent and find out what the situation is with their seller and how the cooperation is going to work before we go in the door.
[46:07] Leigh Brown: And while I do enjoy talking to other agents like you do, it builds a better transaction when we have a good working relationship, not every agent you can get on the phone because some of them are part- timersand some of them don't want to work together.
[46:21] Leigh Brown: And it's created some challenges for the consumer.
[46:23] Leigh Brown: and I just don't think it was handled properly.
[46:29] Leigh Brown: And I do think that the end consumer has been hurt by the lawsuit and not helped by it, just because it's made real estate more difficult.
[46:40] Leigh Brown: And there's no reason to make one of the hardest things more difficult.
[46:44] Leigh Brown: Now I will say that the challenge we also are going to see is that I think we've got a diminished reputation as a trade organization- and the National Association has done very important work over the years advocating for private property rights- and I think that opportunity has been squandered because we have elected officials that now look at us with a wary eye, even though we are not the bad guys here.
[47:11] Leigh Brown: So I think there's going to be some long- termchallenges in the market, but there's a positive, because since you and I both know the National Association of Realtors has a tendency to lean towards the progressive side of things, and I hesitate to call it woke, but it's fairly woke.
[47:27] Leigh Brown: I think there's an opportunity here, as the organization gets diminished, for good brokers and good agents to keep up the conversation with their elected officials about how important property rights are and how important it is to have a strong housing market.
[47:44] Leigh Brown: So maybe they'll listen to the people more and the organization less, just like we're seeing on the government level.
[47:50] Karen Levine: Oh, and I think that's a great comparison and analogy is here in the Colorado market.
[47:55] Karen Levine: The nice thing is, is we started acknowledging practicing buyer agency back in 1991.
[48:06] Karen Levine: What I have found is it's actually created a more free market than negotiations of fees is in the contract, which made it more transparent.
[48:17] Karen Levine: And we're finding that, as you said, not necessarily to the benefit of the consumer because it created more levels of government, more levels of policy, which always creates more cost.
[48:30] Karen Levine: And so that did not help the affordability conversation.
[48:35] Karen Levine: But we continue to see really professionals in the marketplace, and those who didn't understand the changes have not adapted well.
[48:47] Karen Levine: But I think the quality of the realtor profession is actually being enhanced in our market, which is positive.
[48:57] Leigh Brown: And I got to point out there, too, because somebody like you, with your years of experience and how seasoned you are, I think the consumer really does understand.
[49:05] Leigh Brown: And now there's a difference between you and somebody who's newly licensed.
[49:09] Leigh Brown: And you and I were both newly licensed at one point.
[49:13] Leigh Brown: It took us a while to get good, but the consumer shouldn't have had to pay as much for a newly licensed person as for somebody who's highly seasoned.
[49:20] Leigh Brown: So I'm sure that part of the reason your phone rings is that people know what they get when they call you.
[49:26] Leigh Brown: They get ethical, competent knowledge, and that means something to the consumer.
[49:34] Karen Levine: And I think that's true is, you know, the old quote, you get what you pay for is true in a real estate transaction as well.
[49:42] Karen Levine: I also appreciated what you said about the National Association.
[49:48] Karen Levine: And when I became a realtor, we were much more conservative thinking.
[49:54] Karen Levine: We were much more private property owner driven.
[50:04] Karen Levine: Holding on to that, watching very closely what type of policies and legislation went forward that would affect housing, and I have watched that change over the years, which is a little bit disheartening.
[50:17] Karen Levine: But I think, locally, sitting on our government affairs Committee at the local association, I sort of was on my soapbox at an earlier in the year meeting saying that if we don't start standing firm about homeownership and private property rights, that amenity, that American dream will get whittled away.
[50:43] Karen Levine: And a fellow committee member said we should all be on a soapbox.
[50:49] Karen Levine: And I appreciated the fact that he understood.
[50:52] Karen Levine: You know really the threat that a lot of this legislation and policy has caused to home ownership, and yet the american people want that american dream, and we have the ability to help them achieve that.
[51:10] Leigh Brown: Proof of that, too, is I love that you're focused on the local level, but that's where we all have to keep our eye on the ball.
[51:19] Leigh Brown: A field of traditional values is because we didn't focus on the local enough.
[51:24] Leigh Brown: But there was an Obama era policy promoted by the National Association of Realtors on the federal level, called Affirmatively Furthering Fair Housing or AFFH.
[51:36] Leigh Brown: And that was a rule that was designed to take local zoning controls away.
[51:40] Leigh Brown: And the feds could say, look, you're in a suburban neighborhood.
[51:42] Leigh Brown: We're going to put low income multifamily in the middle of your neighborhood, whether you want it or not.
[51:48] Leigh Brown: And that decision should only be made by the locals.
[51:53] Leigh Brown: Well, the realtors have been pushing that for, I guess, a decade now.
[51:57] Leigh Brown: And our new HUD secretary, Scott Turner from Texas, who was a wonderful cabinet pick by President Trump, they have put that policy in the dustbin and it is gone.
[52:08] Leigh Brown: And I am so grateful that they understand each community should have the power to make its own decisions.
[52:15] Leigh Brown: And it doesn't matter what a trade association says, it matters what the people say, and I'm very, very glad for that.
[52:24] Karen Levine: Um, anything else you would like to cover in the last couple minutes we have together?
[52:31] Karen Levine: I love um, that you have the willingness to hop on.
[52:35] Karen Levine: I know, since you're on the east coast, it's not as early there.
[52:41] Leigh Brown: But I appreciate you getting on to cover the show so early yourself, because I know you've got a big heart for the listeners of the Kim Monson show and the work that you're doing out there.
[52:51] Leigh Brown: I would just say that when you get focused on the news cycle, it's easy to get wrapped up in it every day.
[52:58] Leigh Brown: And we can even make politics almost an idol.
[53:01] Leigh Brown: But you've got to remember what the underlying story is.
[53:05] Leigh Brown: And so for me, it's been driven home with the tragedy in western North Carolina that the story is about community and what housing actually means.
[53:13] Leigh Brown: It's more than the pretty houses that you and I enjoy selling.
[53:17] Leigh Brown: But even while I focus on North Carolina, I can't forget what's going on in Kentucky and West Virginia with their recent flooding, or California with the loss of entire towns that weren't all fancy.
[53:29] Leigh Brown: Like Altadena had a lot of fixed-income senior citizens.
[53:33] Leigh Brown: Or what happened in Maui, where we were still never told the story about what happened with the children and those houses that burned down.
[53:41] Leigh Brown: And so my request is just that we all pay better attention, ask better questions, and don't forget the everyday citizens that are being targeted by forces that are bigger than they are.
[53:54] Leigh Brown: And reality is we, the American people, can take care of a whole bunch of things that the global elite just can't understand our spirit, and so we can't let it go.
[54:04] Leigh Brown: And whether it's supporting your local real estate agent instead of calling some company like Opendoor or Orchard, There's decisions we can all make every day that impact our communities, and it might seem like it's more difficult or more expensive, but in the long run, it's probably the best possible outcome.
[54:24] Karen Levine: I had shared one of the news headlines had to do with moving the SBA out of Metro Denver.
[54:31] Karen Levine: And our small businesses, of which you and I are members of small business, we are small business.
[54:39] Karen Levine: and small business has been the foundation of America.
[54:45] Karen Levine: It has built and helped to build the American dream.
[54:50] Karen Levine: And I am reminded of my memory Bible verse, which is love your God with all your heart, with all your soul, with all your mind.
[55:00] Karen Levine: And this is the great and first commandment, but the second is like it.
[55:04] Karen Levine: And that is love your neighbor as yourself.
[55:07] Karen Levine: And when we take on that attitude and that belief system, our communities will thrive.
[55:17] Karen Levine: Well, I have always, I always love hearing you.
[55:22] Karen Levine: I so appreciate you taking time this morning to be on the Kim Monson show with me.
[55:28] Karen Levine: And as I fumble through trying to be never an equal host to Kim, but step into her shoes, I think we covered some really good topics.
[55:39] Karen Levine: I hope the listeners have enjoyed hearing from you and I.
[55:50] Karen Levine: Take care of your heart, soul, mind, and body.
[55:55] Karen Levine: And I look forward to hearing and talking from you, Lee, in the future.
[56:06] Song/Music: High through the mountains climbing, twisting, turning further from my home A young like a new moon rising fierce to the rain enlightening Wandering out into this great unknown And I don't want no one to cry But tell them if I don't survive I don't want to be The views and opinions expressed on KLZ 560 are those of the speaker, commentators, hosts, their guests, and callers.
[56:58] Crawford Broadcasting Disclaimer: They are not necessarily the views and opinions of Crawford Broadcasting or KLZ Management, employees, associates, or advertisers.
[57:04] Crawford Broadcasting Disclaimer: KLZ 560 is a Crawford Broadcasting God and country station.
[57:08] KLZ Announcer: KLZ AMHT Denver, AM 560 and 100.
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[57:15] KLZ Announcer: Another hour of the Kim Monson Show is coming up on KLZ 560.
[57:20] KLZ Announcer: KLZ AMHT Denver, AM 560 and 100.
[57:25] KLZ Announcer: 7 FM.
[57:29] Movie Promo Voice: We are looking for four girls who would like to learn about robotics and compete with teams from other countries.
[57:40] Rule Breakers Promo: In the new Angel Studios movie Rule Breakers, now in theaters, we meet a courageous teacher with an outlandish dream.
[57:46] Rule Breakers Promo: This Afghani woman's name is Roya, and her dream involves mentoring four adolescent girls as they participate in an international robotics competition.
[58:00] KLZ Announcer: It's the Kim Monson Show, analyzing the most important stories.
[58:07] Kim Monson: The socialization of transportation, education, energy, housing, and water, what it means is that government controls it through rules and regulations.
[58:19] KLZ Announcer: The latest in politics and world affairs.
[58:22] Kim Monson: Under this guise of bipartisanship and nonpartisanship, it's actually tapping down the truth.
[58:28] KLZ Announcer: Today's current opinions and ideas.
[58:32] Kim Monson: On an equal field in the battle of ideas, mistruths and misconceptions is getting us into a world of hurt.
[58:39] KLZ Announcer: Is it freedom or is it force?
[58:44] KLZ Announcer: Let's have a conversation.
[58:49] Karen Levine: I am Karen Levine, and I am thrilled to host the show.
[58:52] Karen Levine: Kim is traveling today, so let's have a conversation.
[59:01] Karen Levine: Take care of your heart, soul, mind, and body.
[59:05] Karen Levine: Thank you to Producer Joe for your good work.
[59:06] Karen Levine: He's keeping me on track today as I'm fumbling through the task of hosting the Kim Monson Show.
[59:14] Karen Levine: Remember to visit Kim's website, KimMonson.
[59:22] Karen Levine: You'll get the first look at all our upcoming guests as well as our most recent essays.
[59:28] Karen Levine: You can also email Kim at Kim at KimMonson.
[59:31] Karen Levine: We want to thank Laramie Energy for their gold sponsorship of the show.
[59:36] Karen Levine: It is reliable, efficient, affordable, and abundant energy from oil and gas and oil and gas derivatives that power our lives, fuels our hopes, our dreams, and the prosperity of everyday Americans.
[59:57] Karen Levine: And I selected listen because each year I read a little red book.
[60:02] Karen Levine: It is called One Word That Will Change Your Life.
[60:06] Karen Levine: And in the past, I have had words like curiosity, gratitude, joy.
[60:16] Karen Levine: And this year, I selected listen, which is a verb.
[60:20] Karen Levine: And it means to pay attention to sound, to hear something with thoughtful attention, give consideration, and to be alert to catch an unexpected sound.
[60:31] Karen Levine: And then my quote of the day follows suit by.
[60:37] Karen Levine: He was a cartoonist and a con and um a columnist with the trenton times.
[60:44] Karen Levine: He started writing for them in 1960 and frank said: be a good listener, your ears will never get you in trouble.
[60:56] Karen Levine: That's why we have two ears right and one mouth.
[60:59] Karen Levine: I was just about to say that exactly exactly so, um, as we move into the second hour, um, I might share, uh, let's just see here I wanted to share a couple of um uh things that happened historically on March 10th and I shared these in the first hour and I find them very interesting because in 1862, the U.
[61:26] Karen Levine: issues first paper money in the form of a 5, 10, 20, 50, 100,$ 500,000 notes.
[61:35] Karen Levine: So that gave us the ability to trade with paper currency.
[61:40] Karen Levine: We are moving into Stanley Cup season, and we'll see how well the Colorado Avalanche does in the playoffs as we move forward.
[61:51] Karen Levine: But the Stanley Cup in 1900, I never realized the Stanley Cup had been around so long.
[61:58] Karen Levine: So 1900, the Stanley Cup occurred in Montreal Arena in Westmont, Quebec, Montreal.
[62:06] Karen Levine: The Montreal Shamrocks outclassed the Halifax Crescents to a score of 11 to 0, and they swept the Challenge Series 2 to 0.
[62:15] Karen Levine: Another very interesting thing that happened on march 10th.
[62:21] Karen Levine: In 1922, this radio station, klz am in denver, colorado, began its radio transmissions.
[62:31] Karen Levine: They've been around a bit, and then, in 1971, the u.
[62:36] Karen Levine: S senate approved an amendment lowering voting age to 18.
[62:40] Karen Levine: 1980, Willard Scott became the weather forecaster on the Today Show.
[62:48] Karen Levine: So a lot happening on March 10th over the decades.
[62:52] Karen Levine: Lastly, maybe we'll share a couple of the headlines that we're seeing, and the one that's super dear to my heart is.
[63:03] Karen Levine: The headline reads: dueling construction defects.
[63:07] Karen Levine: Bills display democrat divide, and there are two bills that have been introduced.
[63:13] Karen Levine: Of all the factors contributing to colorado's housing affordability crunch, one that garners the most bipartisan agreement is the need to reform the state's construction defect laws, but a pair of bills working their way through the legislature highlight the historical near impossibility of passing anything of substance.
[63:33] Karen Levine: They also show fault line within the governing democratic coalition that republicans might be able to exploit to their advantage.
[63:45] Karen Levine: Even as recently as 2015, the then liberal, but not quite uniformly progressive, denver city council passed a construction defect ordinance designed to prevent frivolous lawsuits, or lawsuits without actual victims.
[63:59] Karen Levine: So that was a potential step in the right direction.
[64:03] Karen Levine: House Bill 251272, which has been introduced, would make some reasonable changes to construction defect laws for so-called middle market housing, multifamily attached housing of at least two units that is selling below the maximum loan limits for this county.
[64:20] Karen Levine: So they're segmenting out a portion of our housing when, in fact, that bill affects all housing.
[64:27] Karen Levine: But we do know that construction defects has limited the construction of condominium ownership units, and that's what we'd like to see returned to our market, which would be an affordable option to our citizens.
[64:39] Karen Levine: So we'll continue to do a lot of work down at the state with regards to pulling back some of that construction defect legislation.
[64:49] Karen Levine: The Colorado Association of Realtors is heavily involved in that.
[64:54] Karen Levine: As we continue through our morning, I'd like to take a minute and hear from Roger Mangan.
[64:59] Kim Monson: And I'm talking with Roger Mangan with the Roger Mangan State Farm Insurance Team.
[65:03] Kim Monson: And last week, Roger, we were talking about transfer of risk.
[65:07] Kim Monson: And how does life insurance work into that equation?
[65:18] Roger Mangan: As we travel through the society we live in and become responsible adults, we're faced with many difficult and obligatory decisions.
[65:27] Roger Mangan: Education, career choices, marriage, housing, just to name a few.
[65:32] Roger Mangan: We're also left to make lifestyle choices, not obligatory ones.
[65:38] Roger Mangan: And I'm talking about hobbies, travel, recreation, entertainment.
[65:44] Roger Mangan: And I think sometimes we lose our balance in terms of these choices.
[65:47] Roger Mangan: The art of living is balancing these choices and not leaving yourself exposed to obvious risk.
[65:54] Roger Mangan: This brings me to the subject of protecting your most valuable asset, the economic engine that allows your life and lifestyle to go on and on.
[66:04] Roger Mangan: You are the engine that produces the wealth.
[66:07] Roger Mangan: So, for example, what is your worth as a human being?
[66:13] Roger Mangan: Once you have a job, you're making$ 100,000 a year, you're 40 years old, and you're going to work 25 more years.
[66:21] Roger Mangan: That concludes to you earning$ 25 million potentially.
[66:27] Roger Mangan: We insure our$ 35,000 car, we pay$ 1,000 a year, and over 25 years we pay the insurance company$ 25,000.
[66:40] Roger Mangan: As a matter of fact, it costs us to keep and maintain that asset.
[66:43] Roger Mangan: So if you paid$ 1,000 a year to insure and protect a$ 35,000 asset, a depreciating asset as well, wouldn't it make sense to spend$ 600 a year to insure your human life value for$ 25 million?
[66:59] Roger Mangan: Those are the kinds of thoughts that we need to open up in people's minds, your listeners' minds, and sit down with us and let us show you how to solve that conundrum.
[67:14] Kim Monson: Well, and what would be the best way for people to reach you to do that?
[67:19] Roger Mangan: Well, if you are interested in getting into some significant conversations, we're willing to be there for you.
[67:30] Kim Monson: Okay, and for sure, I think people should sit down and take a look at it.
[67:35] Kim Monson: One question on this, though, and I understand what you're saying regarding lifestyle risk.
[67:39] Kim Monson: So many of our young people, young families, they're really getting squeezed in so many different ways.
[67:46] Kim Monson: And I think I know the answer to this, but you'd really recommend that they make some choices with all that's out there to transfer this risk in case of injury or death, right?
[68:02] Roger Mangan: And these lifestyle choices of recreation, entertainment, travel, vacations, I think we can help them plot that out.
[68:10] Roger Mangan: And if they're honest and say, okay, here's what I spend on Starbucks, here's what I do when I go out with the boys or the girls and spend money out.
[68:19] Roger Mangan: And I'm not saying you don't want to do that, but you have to certainly have some balance.
[68:24] Roger Mangan: And if you could divert some of those lifestyle choices to buying life insurance.
[68:30] Roger Mangan: For example, life insurance on a 40-year-old male, a million dollars of that coverage is somewhere around$ 52 a month.
[68:41] Roger Mangan: You divide Starbucks or Burger King or whatever you want to do into that.
[68:47] Roger Mangan: If you're doing it five times, six times a week, some people eat out all the time.
[68:52] Roger Mangan: And you push it back to three times or two times.
[68:56] Roger Mangan: You find there's enough money to do what you need to do to take care of those financial responsibilities you have called family.
[69:04] Roger Mangan: And, boy, I would say that we need probably for a 40-year-old male with two children and married, buying a home, somewhere around$ 1.
[69:20] Roger Mangan: If you want to replace your salary at$ 100,000 for five years, that's$ 500,000.
[69:32] Roger Mangan: And if you die, you'd want your wife to have some income replacement and have the mortgage paid.
[69:37] Roger Mangan: And then you have college education or trade school dollars for children, two children.
[69:42] Roger Mangan: You need$ 100,000 in an account today for a five-and six- year-oldso when they're ready to go to school with inflation, you've got enough money in that side account for the children.
[69:54] Roger Mangan: Probably you're not going to pay everything just before your death, so$ 50, 000.
[70:02] Roger Mangan: And that sounds like a lot of money, and it is if you had to come up with it right away.
[70:08] Roger Mangan: But over your lifetime, that's your commitment.
[70:11] Roger Mangan: So I think there's a way for you to spend some of that Starbucks money and spend$ 52 a month on a$ 1..
[70:23] Kim Monson: Okay, and how can people reach you to talk about this, Roger Mangan?
[70:33] Roger Mangan: I have five wonderful employees who are focused and they know what we're about.
[70:45] Roger Mangan: If we don't help you, then you can go your merry way.
[70:54] Kim Monson: Like a good neighbor, the Roger Mangan team is there.
[70:58] Karen Levine Ad Voice: Property is surely a right of mankind as real as liberty, wrote founding father John Adams.
[71:03] Karen Levine Ad Voice: RE- MAXREALTOR® Karen Levine has been working diligently at the local, county, state, and national levels to protect property rights and home ownership.
[71:13] Karen Levine Ad Voice: Karen has navigated the often challenging Colorado metro real estate market for years.
[71:19] Karen Levine Ad Voice: Karen Levine is the trusted professional for you to turn to when you are buying or selling your home, considering a new build, or exploring investment opportunities.
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[71:29] Karen Levine Ad Voice: You want her on your side of the table.
[71:31] Karen Levine Ad Voice: Call Karen at 303- 877-7516.
[71:36] Karen Levine Ad Voice: That's 303- 877-7516.
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[71:47] KLZ Sponsor Announcer: Find a full list of advertising partners on Kim's website, kimmonson.
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[71:52] KLZ Sponsor Announcer: That's Kim, M- O-N-S-O-Ndot com.
[71:57] KLZ Sponsor Announcer: Welcome back.
[72:01] Karen Levine: I am karen levine and I'm pleased to host the show today.
[72:06] Karen Levine: As kim is traveling, remember to visit kim's website kimMonson.
[72:13] Karen Levine: Comum sign up for her weekly newsletter, you'll get the first look at all the upcoming guests, as well as um her most recent essays, and you can always email Kim at Kim at Kim Monson dot com.
[72:27] Karen Levine: Thank you for contributing to support our independent voice and exercising our right of freedom of speech.
[72:33] Karen Levine: One thing you I would encourage you to consider is something that should be on your bucket list is a visit to the Center for American Values, which is located in the beautiful Riverwalk in Pueblo.
[72:46] Karen Levine: The Center for American Values was co- foundedby Medal of Honor recipient Drew Dix and Emmy award- winningdocumentary maker Brad Padula.
[72:56] Karen Levine: The center is focused on honoring our Medal of Honor recipients and teaching and upholding the principles of America, honor, integrity, and patriotism.
[73:06] Karen Levine: For more information, check out their website, AmericanValuesCenter.
[73:14] Karen Levine: Um we are excited, um and hopefully we'll have on the line with us brian phillips, um he is the founder of the texas institute of property rights.
[73:26] Karen Levine: Um he's the author of affordable housing crisis causes and cures.
[73:30] Karen Levine: Um that's the affordable housing crisis causes and cures by uh brian phillips, and and that can be obtained on Amazon.
[73:43] Karen Levine: Brian Phillips has been actively defending individual rights for the past 25 years.
[73:46] Karen Levine: He has successfully helped defeated attempts to implement zoning in Houston, Texas, and Hobbs, New Mexico.
[73:56] Karen Levine: His writing has appeared in the Freeman Reason, the Orange County Register, the House Houston Chronicle, the Objective Standard, and dozens of other publications.
[74:06] Karen Levine: Again, his book, The Affordable Housing Crisis, Causes and Cures, can be purchased at Amazon.
[74:14] Karen Levine: This conversation is hopefully going to happen.
[74:19] Karen Levine: It kind of came about because Kim wanted to know what I would like to talk about as I hosted her show today.
[74:27] Karen Levine: And I have always wanted to have a conversation about: how do you bring affordable and attainable housing to our communities without incentives?
[74:34] Karen Levine: And Kim, as she does, did some research and some googling and came across Brian and I am hopeful that we'll have a conversation with him.
[74:48] Karen Levine: It sounds like Joe is trying to get him on the line, so let's see who else to remind you of.
[75:00] Karen Levine: Um, we also want to thank the harris family for their gold sponsorship of the show and I'll just reiterate about the usmc memorial foundation.
[75:12] Karen Levine: As you well know, paula sorrows, the president, is diligently working at getting that memorial remodeled, updated and honoring our Gold Star Memorial for Marine Veterans, and that's located over in Golden Office, 6th and Colfax.
[75:34] Karen Levine: While we try to get Brian on the phone, I was sharing some headlines, and we were talking about, I shared about the dueling construction defect bills that are down at the house.
[75:50] Karen Levine: and I've talked a little bit about that they're looking at moving the federal office for the U.
[76:00] Karen Levine: Small Business Administration wants to move out of Denver.
[76:04] Karen Levine: Thursday they announced they'd be relocating that Denver regional office to a less costly, more accessible location, and that is also occurring in other communities across the U.
[76:18] Karen Levine: such as Atlanta, Boston, Chicago, New York, and Seattle.
[76:21] Karen Levine: And Loffler, Kelly Loffler, who is the administrator, noted that these municipalities don't comply with the U.
[76:31] Karen Levine: immigration and customs enforcement actions.
[76:33] Karen Levine: And so the announcement comes on the heels of Denver Mayor Mike Johnston, appearing before the House Committee on Oversight and Government Reform, where he was grilled over state and local policies and laws that limit how local law enforcement can work with federal immigration agents.
[76:53] Karen Levine: The SBA aids small business owners and entrepreneurs in their business ventures, and Kelly also said it would be rolling out new policies that require loan applications for SBA loans to include citizen verification, to ensure that only legal eligible applicants can access SBA programs.
[77:13] Karen Levine: Our small business community is critical to a thriving economy, and hopefully these changes will help small business owners and those seeking to become entrepreneurial.
[77:26] Karen Levine: and I did mention Denver Mayor Mike Johnston the headline was and it was in the denverright.
[77:38] Karen Levine: Denver Mayor faces talk of arrest and criminal investigation in heated DC hearing, Mike Johnston and the mayors of New York City, Chicago, Boston, were summoned to Congress to testify about statutory cities.
[77:53] Karen Levine: Several Republican members of Congress called for criminal investigations or even the arrest of Mayor Mike Johnson and other city officials at an hour- longhearing before the powerful House Oversight Committee in Washington on Wednesday.
[78:14] Karen Levine: Americans are fed up with this betrayal of oaths.
[78:17] Karen Levine: And one of you said you're willing to go to jail, we might give you that opportunity, said Representative Clay Higgins of Louisiana, a comment poignantly directed at Johnson, who previously said that he would stand up for the city's immigration policy, even if it meant arrest.
[78:34] Karen Levine: Representative Gary Palmer of Alabama accused Johnston and the mayors of several other cities of obstruction of justice.
[78:42] Karen Levine: Hopefully they'll get to the bottom of that and we can see more freedom in our communities.
[78:48] Karen Levine: The hearing was part of a larger inquiry by national Republicans into sanctuary cities.
[78:54] Karen Levine: So again, some interesting headlines and we are hopeful that we'll have a conversation here with Brian Phillips.
[79:07] Karen Levine: I know Joe is diligently trying to track him down.
[79:10] Karen Levine: The joys of live radio and your fill- inhost.
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[81:02] Kim Monson Show Ad: If you love The Kim Monson Show, strive for excellence and understand the importance of engaging in the battle of ideas that is raging.
[81:11] Kim Monson Show Ad: Welcome back to The Kim Monson Show.
[81:18] Karen Levine: I'm Karen Levine, and I am pleased to host the show today while Kim is traveling.
[81:23] Karen Levine: We are excited to have Brian Phillips on the line.
[81:27] Karen Levine: He is the author of The Affordable Housing Crisis, Causes and Cures.
[81:32] Karen Levine: And I teed you up a little bit earlier, Brian.
[81:34] Karen Levine: Apparently, if we don't have your correct phone number, it is hard to connect with you.
[81:39] Karen Levine: But I am so glad we got that straightened out.
[81:45] Karen Levine: Well, you know, I don't know if you know the background, but I'm a realtor here in the Metro Denver area.
[81:52] Karen Levine: And I have always wanted to have a conversation about how do we bring affordable, attainable housing to our communities that does not utilize incentives?
[82:02] Karen Levine: And Kim did some research and came across your book and you.
[82:07] Karen Levine: And I would love for you to tell us some of your thoughts and kind of, you know, what do you see as some solutions to creating affordable and attainable housing?
[82:19] Brian Phillips: Well, before I get to that, a big theme in my book is that we're using the wrong framework when we think about housing and, indeed, almost any government policy.
[82:31] Brian Phillips: And by framework, I mean just the way we think about an issue.
[82:46] Brian Phillips: And I call it that because it originated in the progressive era, early 20th century.
[82:52] Brian Phillips: And there's two crucial aspects to that framework that I think create a lot of problems.
[83:07] Brian Phillips: And they look at the short- term benefitsof a policy and fail to consider the long- term benefits.
[83:11] Brian Phillips: And as we know, you know, a lot of times a policy looks like a policy that's going to going to
[83:20] Brian Phillips: It'll be really good in the short term and, for you know, there'll be benefits.
[83:25] Brian Phillips: But we don't examine how it's going to impact other areas, other issues.
[83:31] Brian Phillips: So that's that's one of the problems with the progressive framework, is it?
[83:35] Brian Phillips: It just looked at policies and isolation and in the short term, the other problem, or big problem, is that it uses the group as the standard.
[83:44] Brian Phillips: If we look at almost any policy discussion, the focus is on one group or another.
[83:50] Brian Phillips: How is this policy going to benefit the preferred group?
[83:55] Brian Phillips: And yes, the policy might benefit the people in that group, but that always comes in an expense to non-members of the group and often it is ultimately harmful to the people that it's intended to benefit.
[84:09] Brian Phillips: So I argue in the book that we need a new framework that eliminates these two problems.
[84:18] Brian Phillips: We need to look at the big picture, and not just the short term, but the long term, and we need to look at how other issues impact on the issue we're considering.
[84:29] Brian Phillips: So in regard to housing, there's two aspects to the equation.
[84:36] Brian Phillips: One, obviously, is the cost of housing, but the other aspect, which is typically ignored, is individuals' income or household income.
[84:46] Brian Phillips: The greater our income, the more options we have for affording housing.
[84:51] Brian Phillips: So we have to look at both sides of the equation before we can really address the issue.
[84:59] Brian Phillips: Not sure if I obviously I didn't answer your question, but we need to start with a new framework, a new way of thinking about it.
[85:09] Karen Levine: Well, no, I appreciate you starting there with the framework, and it brings to light a conversation we have been having, I have been having on the Kim Monson Show over the years.
[85:22] Karen Levine: Over a decade ago, here in the state of Colorado, we passed legislation as we commonly refer to as construction defect legislation.
[85:32] Karen Levine: and that put a lot of limitations guardrails around developers and builders and put them in a position where lawsuits against them could be very evident and the fear of lawsuits then cause them to not build our entry-level housing which is typically condominium ownership units And at the time when the policymakers, our elected officials, representatives, were being thoughtful about this, they did exactly what you said.
[86:06] Karen Levine: They looked at that issue for the present, and they didn't look at the long-term effects of that issue.
[86:13] Karen Levine: They looked at people who had been harmed in condominium units, maybe because the construction quality wasn't to part, and yet it met building standards, that maybe there were shortcuts taken and it wasn't caught during inspections.
[86:29] Karen Levine: But then ensued people having problems with their homes, which then led to lawsuits, etc.
[86:37] Karen Levine: So this legislation was supposed to help in that manner.
[86:41] Karen Levine: And now we sit in a marketplace that has a housing shortage and predominantly entry-level housing.
[86:48] Karen Levine: So I appreciate that conversation about the framework.
[86:54] Brian Phillips: And let me just add, let me explain what I think the new framework should be.
[87:00] Brian Phillips: First, we should consider the full context and the big picture.
[87:15] Brian Phillips: We need to free up housing producers, and we need to free up housing consumers.
[87:22] Brian Phillips: There are a lot of restrictions and regulations on builders, as you just pointed out, or disincentives to build.
[87:30] Brian Phillips: But there are also a lot of the restrictions on our ability to improve our income and our wealth, to afford better housing.
[87:43] Brian Phillips: And there's only, like I said, the progressive framework focuses on a group.
[87:48] Brian Phillips: So the new framework needs to focus on individuals.
[87:51] Brian Phillips: If we focus on any group, it's coming at the expense of non-members.
[87:58] Brian Phillips: And there's, but if we focus on the individual and what's good for all individuals, what enables and empowers all individuals, there's only one answer, and that's individual rights, the freedom of each individual to act as he thinks best so long as he respects the freedom of others to do the same.
[88:18] Brian Phillips: And that applies to us, both the housing producers and to us as housing consumers.
[88:25] Brian Phillips: And before we can consume housing, we have to produce other things.
[88:32] Brian Phillips: We can't just look at builders and developers and what's stopping them from building affordable housing.
[88:40] Brian Phillips: We have to look at what's stopping the housing consumers from being able to afford housing more easily.
[88:48] Karen Levine: Yeah, I definitely understand where you're coming from.
[88:52] Karen Levine: And as you were commenting on focusing on the individual, the thought that crossed my mind was freedom, and that's how you concluded.
[89:01] Karen Levine: So I think certainly I'm understanding your thought process and freeing up the limitations on producers and consumers, which then opens up the market more.
[89:15] Brian Phillips: Yeah, there's so many restrictions on us, both as producers and consumers, and the government needs to get out of the way.
[89:26] Brian Phillips: And that could be a good segue to some of my suggestions for what can be done to make housing more affordable.
[89:38] Karen Levine: And we have about, oh, five or six more minutes that we can have this conversation, then we'll take a break.
[89:47] Brian Phillips: I think the biggest culprit in the affordable housing crisis is zoning, and particularly single-family zoning.
[90:06] Brian Phillips: And some locales have done that, either explicitly eliminated single-family zoning or at least allowed duplexes and triplexes on a piece of land that formerly was zoned for single-family zoning.
[90:25] Brian Phillips: But the reason zoning causes, drives up the cost of housing is because it limits the land available for housing.
[90:34] Brian Phillips: For example, and minimum lot sizes are typically a part of zoning.
[90:39] Brian Phillips: So let's say a lot, the minimum lot size is 1,000 square feet.
[90:44] Brian Phillips: Well, you can only build one housing unit on that lot.
[90:54] Brian Phillips: You could put in a small apartment building with five or six units perhaps.
[91:02] Brian Phillips: I live near Houston, and in a lot of areas, developers have bought a couple of lots that previously each held one single-family house, and they put in six or eight or maybe even more townhomes they build up because they have a small footprint so they can get more housing units on a piece of land.
[91:23] Brian Phillips: But with single-family zoning, like I said, it limits the land that's available for housing.
[91:33] Brian Phillips: I've seen, you know, in some cities it's a quarter of a million dollars.
[91:38] Brian Phillips: Well, you can't build housing that's affordable for low and moderate income households when your starting point is a quarter of a million dollars.
[91:49] Brian Phillips: But if you could put six or eight units on that piece of land, the cost of the land is now divided between multiple housing units.
[92:00] Brian Phillips: So the resulting housing is probably still going to be too expensive for low-and moderate- incomefamilies.
[92:08] Brian Phillips: But it just illustrates the point that zoning is limiting the availability of land, and so it drives up the cost of housing.
[92:19] Karen Levine: So as I'm processing what you're saying, Brian, is in utilizing zoning, zoning took away the freedom of how to use the land, which then, you know, restricted that use, which in doing so drives up the price of a single family lot.
[92:42] Karen Levine: Then my other side of my brain says: but what about our citizens who cherish that single family dwelling living?
[92:52] Karen Levine: And- and as you mentioned, we need to look at the individual- how do we address the need for more units of housing and yet those who would prefer to live in a single family dwelling?
[93:11] Brian Phillips: It has a lot of land use restrictions, but it doesn't have comprehensive zoning.
[93:17] Brian Phillips: But so a lot of neighborhoods have deed restrictions, or sometimes they're called covenants.
[93:24] Brian Phillips: And these are attached to the deed of the property, and they limit how the property can be used, how the land can be used.
[93:33] Brian Phillips: Most of the deed restrictions say single family only, single family homes only.
[93:39] Brian Phillips: In fact, I live in a neighborhood with deed restrictions and single family homes are all that are allowed.
[93:47] Brian Phillips: And some people equate deed restrictions with zoning because they do some similar things, but there's a crucial difference.
[93:54] Brian Phillips: Zoning is coercive been mandatory, whereas deed restrictions are voluntary and contractual.
[94:02] Brian Phillips: If you don't like the deed restrictions in one community, you can move to another community.
[94:08] Brian Phillips: So you get to choose the restrictions that you're willing to accept.
[94:16] Brian Phillips: Well, you can move out of the city, but virtually every city in the country has zoning.
[94:32] Brian Phillips: So you can agree to be bound by those restrictions or not.
[94:41] Karen Levine: We had a conversation in our government affairs committee at the Realtor Association about a single family property that is larger than a typical standard single- familylot and their desire to put a um auxiliary auxiliary dwelling unit, an adu, on their property, and the zoning prohibits that.
[95:10] Karen Levine: They should have some inherent private property rights, um.
[95:13] Karen Levine: So where would you take that discussion for somebody?
[95:22] Brian Phillips: Seriously, get rid of zoning and allow people to use their land as they want.
[95:30] Brian Phillips: It doesn't mean that we're going to just create chaos.
[95:34] Brian Phillips: And I talk about some ways that you can eliminate zoning and not create the chaos that some predict would occur.
[95:56] Brian Phillips: One of the arguments for single- familyzoning is it creates a certain type of neighborhood.
[96:04] Brian Phillips: And if we allow multifamily or other types of housing, it's going to disrupt the character of the neighborhood.
[96:11] Brian Phillips: And certainly if somebody built a 500- unitapartment complex in the middle of a neighborhood, that could be disruptive.
[96:25] Brian Phillips: And they can be built in a way that is consistent with the characteristics of the neighborhood.
[96:34] Brian Phillips: A two- storyapartment building with six units isn't going to look out of place in most single- familyneighborhoods.
[96:50] Brian Phillips: And it just refers to housing that's between single family and large apartment complexes and includes duplexes, triplexes, townhomes, small apartment buildings, ADUs.
[97:04] Brian Phillips: And that could fill in or provide a lot of affordable housing if it were allowed.
[97:17] Karen Levine: But one thought I had too, when you were talking about the individual, and I was thinking of housing that is brought to the marketplace through Habitat for Humanity, and a part of me feels like that is a organization that looked at the individual and looked at how do you put, afford, allow somebody to own a home by putting in sweat, equity and the.
[97:48] Karen Levine: There were limitations, obviously, as you mentioned, um, you know their income, their household income and the cost of housing.
[97:56] Karen Levine: Would that be an example of some of the ways you could address some of the things you're talking about?
[98:01] Brian Phillips: Certainly, and I talked about habitat for humanity in the book, um, and it's a, it's a great example of putting your money where your mouth is.
[98:10] Brian Phillips: A lot of people demand that the government do something.
[98:16] Brian Phillips: Well, if the government creates a program for first- timehomebuyers, that's coming at the expense of everyone else.
[98:24] Brian Phillips: Whereas a voluntary private organization like Habitat for Humanity, people can contribute to that, donate money or material or labor to help that and create a better result than the government's going to get.
[98:44] Brian Phillips: So I'm totally for private and even charitable organizations doing things like that.
[98:51] Brian Phillips: Like I said, it's putting your money where your mouth is instead of putting other people's money where your mouth is.
[99:00] Karen Levine: We need to take a quick break, but let's come back and continue this conversation with Brian Phillips.
[99:05] Karen Levine: Right now, we'd love to hear from one of Kim's sponsors, which would be Bose& Law.
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[101:31] Karen Levine: I'm Karen Levine, and I am pleased to host the show today as Kim is traveling.
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[101:46] Karen Levine: We are having a lovely conversation with Brian Phillips, and he is the author of The Affordability.
[101:54] Karen Levine: I lost the title, Brian, but it's about affordability of housing.
[101:58] Karen Levine: And I had an interesting text that came across from one of our listeners.
[102:04] Karen Levine: So I think it's a good jumping off point for the rest of our conversation.
[102:08] Karen Levine: We have, oh, about eight minutes that we can continue this conversation.
[102:12] Karen Levine: And her comment, initial comment was that getting rid of single family zoning sounds bizarre.
[102:20] Karen Levine: that zoning does protect and that she would not agree with that concept.
[102:26] Karen Levine: And if you don't have zoning, you have no control over what happens next to you.
[102:31] Karen Levine: It creates no protection for the people who have been there.
[102:35] Karen Levine: She felt that it felt a little bit bizarre and that was a little like our friends at Black Rock, maybe a little bit on the more socialist side of thinking, and creates craziness.
[102:49] Karen Levine: She commented that she thinks zoning is important, and that's why they are trying to attack single family ownership and are putting big apartments in the middle of single family communities, which we have seen here in the metro, Denver area.
[103:05] Karen Levine: So I'll use those comments as a place to jump off to continue our conversation.
[103:10] Brian Phillips: Well, I would disagree that abolishing zoning is socialist.
[103:18] Brian Phillips: What I'm arguing for is allow the market to operate.
[103:25] Brian Phillips: But but as I said we, there are alternatives to zoning to protect the character of single- familyneighborhoods.
[103:35] Brian Phillips: Indeed, restrictions they're, they're widely used in the houston area, so that's that is an alternative.
[103:43] Karen Levine: Well, I know we, yeah, we excuse me for interrupting.
[103:47] Karen Levine: Um, we see a lot of planned community development in our housing mix here in the colorado area and the denver front range, and um, you know, you make the choice to move into that community based on those restrictions, those covenants, um, and some people want um, that oversight.
[104:11] Karen Levine: Many cases there's a homeowners association involved and then I have customers, consumers, clients that don't want that oversight.
[104:26] Karen Levine: They want more freedom and then they seek homes that are not in covenant controlled and or HOA environments.
[104:30] Karen Levine: So I think that's where you're saying those freedoms exist.
[104:34] Karen Levine: I do have one quick question, which is where does the average housing price land, medium housing price land in the Houston market?
[104:50] Brian Phillips: I'm gonna say maybe a quarter of a million dollars.
[104:57] Karen Levine: Yeah, and I was just curious because knowing that it's a community with um, no zoning, um, that would be a lower medium price than what we see here in colorado.
[105:08] Brian Phillips: Yeah, and in surveys They regularly find that Houston is one of the most affordable large cities in the country, and I attribute that to zoning.
[105:18] Brian Phillips: And I've seen one of the things with zoning, if you want to change the land use, you have to go through a long and expensive process.
[105:26] Brian Phillips: And I've seen land uses change dramatically in certain areas of Houston over the years.
[105:37] Brian Phillips: Often bungalows get torn down and townhouses are built because the area has become more desirable.
[105:48] Brian Phillips: People want to be close to downtown and so they're able to build housing to meet that demand.
[105:53] Brian Phillips: So without zoning, you can change land uses, as market demands change much, much easier than you can with zoning.
[106:05] Karen Levine: When we went to break, we were going to jump into some thoughts you had about, and I think that's creating freedom in the market, to bringing more affordable housing to our marketplaces.
[106:24] Brian Phillips: Zoning typically relegates manufactured housing, you know, to just a certain area.
[106:31] Brian Phillips: But manufacturing housing has come a long way from just the dilapidated trailer that many people think of when they hear manufactured housing.
[106:44] Brian Phillips: And that's much less expensive than traditionally stick- builthouses because it can be built in a factory, and it's not dependent on weather, and they have a lot more control over the construction process.
[107:12] Brian Phillips: I mean, the world's wealthiest man who could afford a palace, he bought one of those.
[107:22] Brian Phillips: mixed- useneighborhoods, which are becoming popular, but zoning outlaws it.
[107:30] Brian Phillips: In fact, one of the purposes of zoning, when it was originally enacted, was to eliminate what was called incompatible land uses.
[107:39] Brian Phillips: They wanted residential land use separated from commercial, separated from industrial.
[107:45] Brian Phillips: But, you know, in the last few decades, mixed- usecommunities, walkable communities have become very popular.
[107:52] Brian Phillips: So, you know, that type of land use could occur much more easily in a free market because builders and developers don't have to grovel at the feet of zoning officials to get permission to change land uses.
[108:15] Brian Phillips: Um, another one that'll probably shock some people is to abolish building codes.
[108:20] Brian Phillips: Um, building codes often impose a lot of expenses on the builder.
[108:28] Brian Phillips: For example, they require energy efficient windows or things like that.
[108:35] Karen Levine: Well, and I appreciate that comment from the standpoint.
[108:39] Karen Levine: We've seen quite a bit of policy and building code changes in in my career and when we add things- and I will use this as an example- you add that all new constructed homes must have an electrical vehicle charging station.
[109:00] Karen Levine: That does not provide freedom to those of us who would prefer not to invest in a electric vehicle charging station, but it does add to the cost of housing.
[109:12] Karen Levine: And when I started in new construction was the beginning of my career, what differentiated builder a from builder b from builder c was the product use, the mix and the cost, and so the consumer, as you said, had more free market to choose from and they would say I will pay more for that particular aspect of a home, but I don't want to pay for that.
[109:38] Karen Levine: And what we've done is made that differentiation actually more complicated or more difficult, which what I'm hearing from you, Brian, has raised.
[109:49] Brian Phillips: Yes, yeah, and some people, I mean I lived in a house with aluminum windows that were probably 50 years old.
[109:59] Brian Phillips: I was perfectly happy because the house was affordable to me and and And a new home buyer, that might be perfectly acceptable, because otherwise you can't afford the house.
[110:12] Brian Phillips: And the builders could offer options, and most builders do from my understanding.
[110:18] Brian Phillips: Here's our standard product or the standard products we use.
[110:25] Brian Phillips: And then the buyer can decide what's worth it to him and what he can afford.
[110:30] Brian Phillips: But the building code imposes this upon everyone, whether they want or need it, and drives up the cost.
[110:38] Karen Levine: Well, and then I go back to the comment that you made that you have to look at the cost of housing as one aspect, one aspect of the affordability quotient, mathematic, whatever, and the other being the house of the income of a household.
[110:56] Karen Levine: And when you don't take both of those into consideration, you may be bringing a product into a market that, I hate to say, it doesn't meet the needs of the people who need the housing and create sort of this log jam in the housing continuum.
[111:16] Karen Levine: You also mentioned manufactured housing and we have a builder in our marketplace, Oakwood homes, that does manufactured housing and they have an amazing presentation in their sales office about the construction of their homes and the beauty of building a home in a warehouse is you can control um a lot of the product and the process that you can't control out in the field, and having those controls brings the price down and brings a better quality home to the marketplace Exactly.
[111:52] Brian Phillips: I would like to touch on the restrictions on improving one's income.
[112:05] Brian Phillips: I advocate for– I think there are two big impediments to improving income.
[112:15] Brian Phillips: One is occupational licensing, and the other is minimum wage laws.
[112:22] Karen Levine: Ah, and I got us in a bit of a bind, which means the show's going to cut off here in about 15 seconds.
[112:29] Karen Levine: But what I am going to suggest is maybe Kim can get you back on and we can continue this conversation, because that is an amazing topic of which we've touched on here on the show, and I would love to do that.
[112:41] Karen Levine: I apologize for cutting you off, but I want to thank you for being on, And I want to just say to our listeners today, be grateful, read great books, think good thoughts, listen to beautiful music, communicate and listen well, live honestly and authentically, strive for high ideals and like Superman, stand for the truth, justice in the American way.
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